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V7ii ABS brake bleeding.

Jenko

Tuned and Synch'ed
Joined
Feb 15, 2016
Messages
97
Location
Shropshire UK
Hi all
I need to slacken off my front brake master cylinder banjo bolt to move the lever to a comfortable angle.
Just in case I get air into the system, has anyone bled one of these brakes with the ABS system?
In the past, I've never had problems bleeding brakes, but I've never done a bike with ABS. The brake hose doesn't just go from the master cylinder to the caliper, it goes to the ABS ECU, then to the caliper, so if air gets in at the master cylinder, in theory I'd have to drag it through the ecu and then to the caliper, which seems complicated.
The reason I need to move the banjo bolt is due to fitting flat handlebars on my Racer, and the lever is now at a strange angle. I'll have to grind off the small lug on the cylinder that prevents rotation of the brake hose when the banjo is tightened, then move the hose round a few degrees. Just before I get someone telling me I only need to slacken the 2 8mm bolts on the brake lever clamp!
Thnaks for any advice.
Jenko.
 
I've bled a couple bikes with ABS now. It's pretty much the same drill, but, as you noted, you have a lot more fluid in the system. You don't need to cycle the ABS pump or anything. It will bleed just fine.
 
I bled the rear brake on my '16 V7II ABS Stone last week, when I replaced the rear caliper (why I had to do that is another story). I don't think it would have made any difference with or without ABS, but I can tell you that with a Speed Bleeder alone I was NOT able to remove all the air from a dry caliper. After wasting most of a can of brake fluid, I went out and got a cheap vacuum bleeder from Harbor Freight. That did the job.
The problem with trying to bleed a new caliper with a Speed Bleeder alone is that air is inevitably trapped behind the pistons in the caliper. With the vacuum bleeder, you can first manually push the pistons all the way into the caliper and then pull fluid through to flush the remaining air out. In contrast, with the Speed Bleeder alone, you push the fluid through, and the pushing pressure moves the pistons outward enough to allow air to accumulate behind them. I tried orienting the caliper in all possible directions, shaking it, tapping it, etc., hoping that the air would rise into the path of the fluid and be flushed out, but to no avail. With the vacuum bleeder , bleeding was a cinch. I would conclude that, although the Speed Bleeder will be convenient for flushing the lines when all I'm trying to do is replace old, bubble-free fluid, it isn't sufficient (at least for me) for getting air out of the system, especially with new calipers.
BTW, those aluminum crush washers that go on either side of the banjos (and should be replaced every time you loosen the banjo bolt) are wicked expensive if you buy the official Moto Guzzi part. Identical ones can be purchased in small quantities on ebay for less than 1/10 the price. The size is 10x14x1.6 mm.
 
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I wrote a suggestion page on fluid changing the old style V7 brakes with the non-ABS. My page might have something for you.
If nothing else, it shows a economical way to do it.
flickr.com/photos/sign216/albums/72157625625067451
Not so economical if I need to hire an expert assistant like yours :)
 
Don't skimp on shop supplies!
Wow!!
Which shop did you get her from? I'm definitelygonna pop in there for some supplies!
I bet those long hours in the workshop become so much more enjoyable when you have such perfect equipment to help!
 
Wow!!
Which shop did you get her from? I'm definitelygonna pop in there for some supplies!
I bet those long hours in the workshop become so much more enjoyable when you have such perfect equipment to help!

People wander into my garage, and some (most?) have no mechanical sense at all.

However for a few of them I don't mind.

Actually, it's a struggle to get "the right people" to come in. Know what I mean?
 
Well, even without the glamorous assistant like sign216 had to help, the job went easy enough. Little trick i used, put an elastic band on the front brake lever to apply a little pressure, but not enough to pull it all the way back to the bar. Then when I cracked the banjo bolt just enough to rotate the brake line on the master cylinder, pressure was trying to force fluid out, so no air could enter the system. Rotated the brake line (after filing the little lug off first), then re-tightened the banjo bolt.
Overnight, used the old moto-x trick of zip-tying the lever back to the bar, just in case any air bubbles are present. Used it today, absolutely fine, no problem. Feels much better with flat drag bars.
Whole job took about 20 minutes, and most of that was filing the lug off.
 
Hi guzzistis, I made the poor choice of bleeding my brakes today on my Moto Guzzi V7 III to get some fresh brake oil in the lines. Front brake went perfectly. No air, braking feels great. Rear brake however is not developing pressure after pumping. It somewhat does and then after a few seconds the pressure subsides. I can hear the fluid being pumped through the ABS system. I've bled and bled and bled and can't seem to get the rear brake system to back pressure. It's just squishy. Reservoir is full. Nothing is leaking. Please help!
 
Try pumping the lever several times and while holding the pressure on, release the bleed nipple, might have to do it quite a few times, you must have got some air in it if it was ok to start with.
 
Thanks Kevin. I have done this probably 50 times at this point and I still can't seem to get the air out. Wondering if air got into the abs pump. I'll give this a try a few more times. If nothing gives, I guess I'm in for a trip to the dealer.
 
been there done that! Even a power bleeder wouldn't do it on the bike. you have to pull the rear caliper and get it higher than the highest line and that means as I recall getting it to the top of the right shock. don't forget to put a crescent wrench in between the pads.

Thank you for that suggestion. I was able to get most of the air out of the line by removing the calipers and depressing the pistons, rebleeding another several cycles, and leaving the pedal pusher down for a few days. Still a little bit of squish in the pedal and slight "swishing" noise near the ABS module but I can't recall if this was normal from before I started. Does that happen on your bike? Brakes seem to work fine even with a half inch or so of squish in the brake pedal.
 
I did hear the noise while I was in your boat with a soft pedal. Never listened after getting it hard. You might be better but still not right. It doesn't take long to pull it and slide it around and up tieing it to the top of the shock. You'll be happy you did.
 
Ah gotcha. I was worried I got air in the ABS system or something. What also may be contributing is a bad bleeder valve. Just noticed mine has an aftermarket one that was replaced by a prior owner and it's leaking. That doesn't help
 
Hi guzzistis, I made the poor choice of bleeding my brakes today on my Moto Guzzi V7 III to get some fresh brake oil in the lines. Front brake went perfectly. No air, braking feels great. Rear brake however is not developing pressure after pumping. It somewhat does and then after a few seconds the pressure subsides. I can hear the fluid being pumped through the ABS system. I've bled and bled and bled and can't seem to get the rear brake system to back pressure. It's just squishy. Reservoir is full. Nothing is leaking. Please help!

Same here on V7 III rear brake.
My mistake was using vacuum pump bleeder on the rear brake, because the rear reservoir holds very little fluid. I have vacuum pump connected and pumped, after cracking open the bleeder, it sucked out the fluid so fast before I could refill the reservoir.

Once the air got in the line, I was not able to get it out. Reverse bleed helped, but still could not get the peddle to firm up. After some research on the internet, I saw Vagrant's post above and decided to just do what he suggested. Here is what I did.

- Remove the caliper (two bolts, torque to 19 ft-lb).
- Unhook the ABS sensor line from the brake line.
- Remove the nut (bolt) holding brake line bracket underneath the swing arm.
- Move the caliper up through the opening between the swing arm and the muffler on the right side of the bike. Used a bungee cord to hold the caliper up near the top of the shock (protect the seat and side cover with a towel).
- Put a flat wrench between the caliper, pump the brake paddle a few times to hold the wrench.
- Connect a 3/16" hose to the bleeder valve and zip-tied it so it won't come loose.
- Open the bleeder valve and tighten it lightly.
- Bleed using the traditional method by pumping the peddle a few times, hold it, open the valve, close it, and repeat. Fill the reservoir after bleeding every three times.
 
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Same here on V7 III rear brake.
My mistake was using vacuum pump bleeder on the rear brake, because the rear reservoir holds very little fluid. I have vacuum pump connected and pumped, after cracking open the bleeder, it sucked out the fluid so fast before I could refill the reservoir.

Once the air got in the line, I was not able to get it out. Reverse bleed helped, but still could not get the peddle to firm up. After some research on the internet, I saw Vagrant's post above and decided to just do what he suggested. Here is what I did.

- Remove the caliper (two bolts, torque to 19 ft-lb).
- Unhook the ABS sensor line from the brake line.
- Remove the nut (bolt) holding brake line bracket underneath the swing arm.
- Move the caliper up through the opening between the swing arm and the muffler on the right side of the bike. Used a bungee cord to hold the caliper up near the top of the shock (protect the seat and side cover with a towel).
- Put a flat wrench between the caliper, pump the brake paddle a few times to hold the wrench.
- Connect a 3/16" hose to the bleeder valve and zip-tied it so it won't come loose.
- Open the bleeder valve and tighten it lightly.
- Bleed using the traditional method by pumping the peddle a few times, hold it, open the valve, close it, and repeat. Fill the reservoir after bleeding every three times.

Thanks for the detailed response Subin. That procedure could have been very helpful when I got air in my line so hopefully it helps others who make the same mistake as us. Safe riding!
 
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