• Ciao Guest - You’ve landed at the ultimate Guzzi site. NEW FORUM REGISTRATIONS REQUIRE EMAIL ACTIVATION - CHECK YOUR SPAM FOLDER - Use the CONTACT above if you need help. New to the forum? For all new members, we require ONE post in the Introductions section at the bottom, in order to post in most of the other sections. ALWAYS TRY A SEARCH BEFORE STARTING A NEW TOPIC - Most questions you may have, have likely been already answered. DON'T BE A DRIVE-BY POSTER: As a common courtesy, check back in and reply within 24 hours, or your post will be deleted. Note there's decades of heavily experienced Guzzi professionals on this site, all whom happily give endless amounts of their VALUABLE time for free; BE COURTEOUS AND RESPECTFUL!
  • There is ZERO tolerance on personal attacks and ANY HYPERLINKS to PRODUCT(S) or other competing website(s), including personal pages, social media or other Forums. This ALSO INCLUDES ECU DIAGnostic software, questions and mapping. We work very hard to offer commercially supported products and to keep info relevant here. First offense is a note, second is a warning, third time will get you banned from the site. We don't have the time to chase repeat (and ignorant) offenders. This is NOT a social media platform; It's an ad-free, privately funded website, in small help with user donations. Be sure to see the GTM STORE link above; ALL product purchases help support the site, or you can upgrade your Forum profile or DONATE via the link above.
  • Be sure to see the GTM STORE link also above for our 700+ product inventory, including OEM parts and many of our 100% Made-in-SoCal-USA GTM products and engine kits. In SoCal? Click the SERVICE tab above for the best in service, tires, tuning and installation of our products or custom work, and don't miss our GT MotoCycles® (not) art on the BUILDS tab above. WE'RE HERE ONLINE ONLY - NO PHONE CALLS MADE OR RECEIVED - DO NOT EMAIL AND ASK QUESTIONS OR ASK TO CALL YOU.
  • Like the new V100, GuzziTech is full throttle into the future! We're now running on an all-new server and we've updated our Forum software. The visual differences are obvious, but hopefully you'll notice the super-fast speed. If you notice any glitches or have any issues, please post on the Site Support section at the bottom. If you haven't yet, please upgrade your account which is covered in the Site Support section or via the DONATE tab above, which gives you full site access including the DOWNLOADS section. We really appreciate every $ and your support to keep this site ad-free. Create an account, sign in, upgrade your account, and enjoy. See you on the road in 2024.

Engine shutting down on cold start

lakson

lakson

Just got it firing!
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
23
Location
Macedonia
I've been riding a new Sport 4V for about a year now. The bike is great. Made some external modifications, but never seemed to find out why on cold engine, when I push the start engine button, it starts, and then immediately shuts down. Even if I try more times.. it's the same.
What I do, is I start it and hold the throttle at ~1300-1500 rpm manually for about 10-20 seconds, and then when released, it's fine, keeping rpm around 1200. But still for the next minute or so.. from time to time it "coughs" , or drops the rpm... like it would just stop again.
When the engine is warm, this is not happening.
This has been happening from day 1.
Any of you guys experience this? I mean is this normal?
 
While I have only limited experience of 4V sport 1200's I don't know of this occurng and it would seem to me to point to incorrect set-up or a stepper problem. Are you showing any error codes on the dashboard?

Pete
 
AFAIK, the ECU on all 1200 2V (and probably the 1100) engines shut off ignition when revs drop under about 800 rpm. Mine tended to do this when it's (really) cold with the previous (2006!) map it had installed - haven't had too much chance to check this winter after the map was finally upgraded to the most recent one (last august). From what I understand, the stepper motor is the most likely culprit though I guess one cannot exclude an issue with the O2 sensor.
 
I have the exact same problem. And since new, it refused two times to even have the starter turn the engine on the first time. I think the starter relay might be the cause. This relay also has a delay if I'm right. That is, I used to touch the button and it would continue to start until the engine would catch. It doesn't do that anymore. Is that right?
 
frank73x89 said:
I have the exact same problem. And since new, it refused two times to even have the starter turn the engine on the first time. I think the starter relay might be the cause. This relay also has a delay if I'm right. That is, I used to touch the button and it would continue to start until the engine would catch. It doesn't do that anymore. Is that right?
Click to expand...

IIRC, the start up sequence of CARC bikes will switch from auto-start to manual if a low battery voltage is detected. Meaning you have to press and hold the start button until it catches, no more one touch and hand off starting anymore.

Phang
 
the start up sequence of CARC bikes will switch from auto-start to manual if a low battery voltage is detected. Meaning you have to press and hold the start button until it catches, no more one touch and hand off starting anymore.
Click to expand...

Well, I never knew that. Thanks Phang.
 
No, there are no errors on the dash, also none registered when I enter the service mode.
The engine starts fine, battery voltage is normal, with just the normal push-and-remove-finger from the start button. But shuts down fast the first couple of times.

Do you think I should check/adjust the idle mixture and/or idle rpm setting ? Or start with the stepper motor?
 
lakson said:
No, there are no errors on the dash, also none registered when I enter the service mode.
The engine starts fine, battery voltage is normal, with just the normal push-and-remove-finger from the start button. But shuts down fast the first couple of times.

Do you think I should check/adjust the idle mixture and/or idle rpm setting ? Or start with the stepper motor?
Click to expand...

To know where you are, start with a valve adjustment and TB sync and TPS reset. If the problems persists, then start poking about the stepper motor and other possible items. Since it has done it since new, have you tried to have the dealership repair under warranty?
 
Idle mix is controlled by the stepper. Do not confuse the throttle body air bleeds with idle mixture screws on carburetors or you'll open yourself up to a world of pain.

Only ONE of the air bleeds should ever have to be open and that may not be neccessary.

First things first though check valve clearances, re-set TPS and restore the factory baseline parameters and make sure that all the sensors are giving accurate readings. It still sounds like a stepper problem to me.

Pete
 
Thanks guys.
Adjusted valve clearances, still same.
For the other things I will need to connect to the ECU as far as I know. And I don't have the proper tools/software. Nearest and only one in my country is a dealer/service with a "Navigator" unit. So I'll go and do the TPS reset and check all the rest. I'll post the results.
 
Hi All, I know that this might be a little long time ago, but still, better now than never :)

Just to let you know that after a service at the dealership which included idle mix check/correction, TPS reset, change of oils and all the normal stuff, this problem disappeared.
So now when I start the engine, it goes on it's own up to about 2000 rpm, and after 10-15 sec. gets back to around 1200-1500 and doesn't shut down.
Thanks to all with the offered propositions and solutions. ;)
 
Hi all, Thats good to know in any case as my brand new 2012 1200 Corsa won't start first press when its totally cold. Only continues to run on second press. Starts first press every other start once its been started and is warm, but from the very first start in the morning, it fires for about 4 seconds, then dies. So it sounds like perhaps this is normal run in behaviour and that the first service adjustments to valve clearences, TB's etc will solve the issue. No big deal, but sounds like this is normal until settings are checked and adjusted by dealer. I'll point this out to the dealer at the 1500km service in a couple of weeks time and let you know what transpires....

Regards to all, Paul.
 
Hello Lakson

I have read with big interesst your problem.
The same problem I do have as well at my Breva 1100

You worte, that the problem has been fixed after a inspection from your dealer.

Do you know, how he solved the problem with the idle?

It would be a big help for me, if you could tell me what the problem was.

Thanks a lot

regards
vincedeguzzi
 
Phang said:
IIRC, the start up sequence of CARC bikes will switch from auto-start to manual if a low battery voltage is detected. Meaning you have to press and hold the start button until it catches, no more one touch and hand off starting anymore.

Phang
Click to expand...
Hello.
What could be the problem for that if the battery over 12V? Relay? connector?
 
lakson said:
I've been riding a new Sport 4V for about a year now. The bike is great. Made some external modifications, but never seemed to find out why on cold engine, when I push the start engine button, it starts, and then immediately shuts down. Even if I try more times.. it's the same.
What I do, is I start it and hold the throttle at ~1300-1500 rpm manually for about 10-20 seconds, and then when released, it's fine, keeping rpm around 1200. But still for the next minute or so.. from time to time it "coughs" , or drops the rpm... like it would just stop again.
When the engine is warm, this is not happening.
This has been happening from day 1.
Any of you guys experience this? I mean is this normal?
Click to expand...
Glad to hear the problem was resolved. On my 2012 Norge I have found that if I give it gas as I push the starter it will fire right up like you used to have to do with a carburated engine. It works so I never questioned it.
 
Interesting thread. I have a new 2015 Norge. I just came back from a 1000 mile ride in western North Carolina and roads around eastern TN, and north GA, so, I've put about 2000 miles on it in the month I've had it. So, when I got it, it started and ran perfectly. While on my trip last week (mostly the last day or two), I noticed it was experiencing this cold start behavior. Started fine, but would immediately die - or, cough and sputter and die, if I didn't give it gas. I got home (trailered the bikes from Cincinnati), and indeed it still did it - UNTIL, I put new gas in it. I seriously think it was suffering from crappy gas from down in the mountains. Many of the stations have 15% (or higher maybe?) ethanol. And, the bike's manual says avoid ethanol diluted gas. All I know is, once I filled up with new gas, it starts from cold and runs smoothly. So, food for thought.
 
It had to be really bad gas. My 2007 Norge had the drain line by the gas cap plugged solid while I was on a trip across Newfoundland and it rained a lot. Almost every time I opened the gas cap I watched water run in the tank. This was a 14 day trip but the bike ran fine the entire time. I was amazed at that.
When I got home I had to drill out the brass fitting in the tank to clear it. 120 psi did not phase it.
I hope it wasn't 15% ethanol. I don't think our plastic tanks will take that. It is a really bad government that when the environmentalists and the oil companies agree and say not to use it that goes ahead and authorizes it anyway.
My 2007 Started and stumbled then died a lot till I performed a cannisterectomy on it. That solved it. It seemed worse when parked in the hot sun. I think the system was building pressure and messing the injection up. Just a SWAG on my part. (Scientific Wild Ass Guess)
 
abbienormal said:
...Almost every time I opened the gas cap I watched water run in the tank. This was a 14 day trip but the bike ran fine the entire time. I was amazed at that.

...I hope it wasn't 15% ethanol. I don't think our plastic tanks will take that.
Click to expand...

Indeed, amazing that it ran with the water mixed in there! And, I hadn't considered the possible effect of the ethanol on the plastic tank. Maybe that's why it's recommended to avoid it. Sucks when there are no options available - as when traveling!
 
Are we really trying to tame the normal idiosyncrasies of a Guzzi.
My first Guzzi, 76,000 kms later, after rexxar re-flash, power commander 5, air modifications, starter switch under the seat, I have learned the allure, so often discussed, comes from our inability to make this bike dull and predictable. She, Ormofi, Greek for female beautiful) has always had a mind and resisted my attempts to make her into a boring and predictable ride. Thus, our many fights were painfully vitriolic, and I did often say I had enough! The next day, on her best behavior all was forgiven and the revolving door relationship continues on and on.

The bike has tamed me. My relaible Triumph, sits idle too often as I feel only at peace as I melt into her seat and form part of her beauty and character.

For those without a Guzzi, buyer beware.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top