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Full Monty on Stock Bike?

guzziben47

guzziben47

Cruisin' Guzzisti
Joined
Jun 5, 2010
Messages
191
Hey, is anyone out there using the full monty (i.e. not just the reflash, but also the power commander and the autotune) on a stock bike (i.e. stock muffler, stock filter, no mods)? I know every bike is different, and it wouldn't hurt but would only help to further refine the tuning with the PC / AT, but I still see it as something having more value for someone who is using a slip on, high flow filter, air box, etc.

Is anyone using the PC / AT with an all stock bike?
 
I am. Although I also have the CNC airbox ring installed and will be getting the higher-flow air filter soon.
 
And a better shock, eventually. A slip-on would also be nice, for a bit of weight reduction, but that's not in the budget right now.
 
mohawkeye said:
In my case, yes :!:
Click to expand...

Inquiring minds would like to know things like............

What did it do to your fuel mileage?

Did you go from stock to the full Monty or did you do just the reflash first and add the PC-V & AT later?

I'm looking for feed back on the reflashed ECU........I'm on the fence, someone needs to give me a push :D
 
I went the stock-to-full-Monty route.

In my case, fuel mileage was secondary to a longer-lasting and cooler-running engine. The better acceleration is gravy :D

As the engine is breaking in (currently 6500 miles) I feel that mileage has improved slightly (getting nearer to 40mpg). While I was diaappointed in it's mileage initally (probably because most of the Stelvio's time has been spent canyon-carving and because a regular riding buddy continually ribs me with his 60+ mpg claims on a F800ST :roll: ), there's no more low-rev stumble and no more bucking either.

Regarding the ECU reflash only, I mentioned in another post (https://www.guzzitech.com/forum/160/4129.html?start=20), the low-rev & small-throttle-opening performance was much-improved.

I'm one of the lucky ones that live in SoCal and can just ride to Todd's for the installation :cool:
 
mohawkeye said:
I went the stock-to-full-Monty route.

In my case, fuel mileage was secondary to a longer-lasting and cooler-running engine. The better acceleration is gravy :D

As the engine is breaking in (currently 6500 miles) I feel that mileage has improved slightly (getting nearer to 40mpg). While I was diaappointed in it's mileage initally (probably because most of the Stelvio's time has been spent canyon-carving and because a regular riding buddy continually ribs me with his 60+ mpg claims on a F800ST :roll: ), there's no more low-rev stumble and no more bucking either.

Regarding the ECU reflash only, I mentioned in another post (https://www.guzzitech.com/forum/160/4129.html?start=20), the low-rev & small-throttle-opening performance was much-improved.

I'm one of the lucky ones that live in SoCal and can just ride to Todd's for the installation :cool:
Click to expand...

Thanks for the feedback Hawkeye, ya I wish Todd was on the right coast, problem / questions could have be easier to address if we were closer, maybe. I just sent him another email (he probably hates me by now) hopefully that will push me off the fence. :?
 
Ok time for me to respond, First mod I made on my Norge was a Staintune and K&N air filter and it was an improvement over stock, Then last year I did the Full Guzzi Tech Monty, ECU re-flash, PCV , Auto Tune, CNC open air box lid and stepper motor bypass kit. I dare say I have one of a handful if that many of best running Norge's in the US of A. I did not respond before because your original post was for a bone stock bike. Gas mileage around 40 + right now (secondary for me ) Engine runs Sooo much cooler now, keep looking for that 7th gear more now cause in 6th there just seems like there should be another gear because of the torque that is still there.
 
draidt said:
Ok time for me to respond, First mod I made on my Norge was a Staintune and K&N air filter and it was an improvement over stock, Then last year I did the Full Guzzi Tech Monty, ECU re-flash, PCV , Auto Tune, CNC open air box lid and stepper motor bypass kit. I dare say I have one of a handful if that many of best running Norge's in the US of A. I did not respond before because your original post was for a bone stock bike. Gas mileage around 40 + right now (secondary for me ) Engine runs Sooo much cooler now, keep looking for that 7th gear more now cause in 6th there just seems like there should be another gear because of the torque that is still there.
Click to expand...

That's nice to hear, but doesn't the Norge come with a much larger fuel tank than the Stelvio, plus your talking about a completely different motor.

Best I have ever done is about 175 miles and the tank is empty, now if the Stelvio had a 7.5 gal tank like my Concours I wouldn't worry, that bike is good for 275+ miles per tank, loaded down and pulling a trailer. A touring motorcycle and those are Guzzi words not mine with a 4.7 gal tank and that is +/- 4/10ths, (Guzzi words again) is a joke.
 
I think the issue is whether the Re-Flash alone will take care of the surging (hesitating, stutterring, etc.) on a stock bike. The PC AT seems to be marketed as something you would use to help the ECU deal with mods to the bike that change the fueling (i.e. adding a high flow filter, removing the CAT, adding a tail pipe, etc.). So, the question is, if you aren't planning on making any of those mods (you are planning on keeping the bike all stock), is there a big difference in low rpm running (i.e. the lean fuel issue we've all discussed ad nauseum; now that i think of it, we should just call that the "ad nauseum issue") between the Re-Flash alone and the Re-Flash plus the PC AT? In other words, will the Re-Flash take care of the ad nauseum issue on a bike with no mods? Or do you need the full monty to address the ad nauseum issue, regardless of the circumstances?
 
My 2 cents on this.....
I think some people are just way over thinking this.
The stock set up is not that bad, but typical of EPA emissions compliant stock fueling it is not perfect and some compromises have been made in the name of meeting said standards as well as having some short comings as a result of variances between local fuels where you may live.
The ECU reflash is an improved stock set up that Todd put some time into optimizing for certain specific variables, like Ca. gas. It should be better then stock but it will not be perfect unless you are Todds neighbor. It is a new fixed map that should work better then stock but it is fixed. It probably won't be perfect.
The PCV takes it further by allowing you to tailor the final result to be optimized based on your bike, the gas you use, and how/where you ride. But to optimize it requires a lot of trial and error or paying someone to do it for you. And if you get the PCV without the ECU reflash and the O2 delete the PCV will only be able to adjust fueling above 40% throttle. Below that, in the closed loop section of the map, the O2 sensor will be in charge. This level allows you to adjust the fueling to meet your needs, with the O2 sensor delete it allows adjustment of the whole range but without the O2 delete you can only adjust the above 40% throttle area that is not relying on the O2 sensor. Below 40% the O2 sensor is in charge.
The full deal, ECU reflash with O2 sensor delete, PCV, and AutoTune, allows you to build your own map that is tailored to your bike, your gas, and where/how you ride. You can change the target air/fuel ratios for your own needs, i.e. best performance or best mileage. This level is self adjusting based on the target values you select for the mixture. You can use the base settings that Todd recommends or you can adjust it yourself as you see fit. Whatever you do the unit will self adjust to meet your target air/fuel ratios. Important to note, while you will likely get more power out of your stock bike with the any of these set ups the real advantage to optimizing the fueling is better, smoother throttle response.
My Griso has the full set up from Todd. Not cheap, but worth every penny to me.
 
But isn't a "fixed" map, not tailored to your specific circumstances (i.e. the gas you use, the way you drive, etc.) what you would normally get from a manufacturer? That may not be optimum, but all some of us are looking for is to correct the ad nauseum issue (lean fueling mandated by Euro emmissions requirements). It seems logical that reprogramming the ECU would be all you need to address that issue.
 
I just got the Re-flash, installed it and took the bike for a ride. And it seems, if all you are interested in is getting rid of the surging, the Re-flash does the trick (it's better than the Memjet). I wouldn't be surprised if you can make the fueling even better with the PC AT, but, to answer my own question, I'm not sure you really need the full monty on a stock bike. I think "need" is the right word; my bike needed the Re-flash to run acceptably, but I don't think it needs the full monty. If I put on a pipe or modified the airbox or something like that, then I think I'd need the PC AT. And I may still order one and give it a try just to see what else I can do with the feuling, but right now I think any additional improvements would be icing on the cake....
 
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