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CARC - how hot can it get?

hhkiwi

hhkiwi

Tuned and Synch'ed
Joined
Mar 21, 2013
Messages
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Location
Ulm, Germany
Had my new (to me) Griso 1100 out for a quick ride on the Autobahn after work today, about half an hour at speeds up to 160 km/h, and when I got home I found that my CARC was very hot - almost too hot to touch. I don't remember the final drive of my 1200 Sport to get so hot but I am not sure. Any feedback from the experts on this?

I did a quick search here but couldn't find a thread on CARC temperatures - if there is one already, my apologies!
 
I suggest you check the oil level. They can get pretty hot if ridden hard, but sufficient oil should help. Also it might not be a bad idea to change the oil to a good synthetic 75W90 oil just to be sure.
 
john zibell said:
I suggest you check the oil level. They can get pretty hot if ridden hard, but sufficient oil should help. Also it might not be a bad idea to change the oil to a good synthetic 75W90 oil just to be sure.
Click to expand...

Actually, I was picking up the bike today from my Guzzi dealer where it had a full service, including a final drive oil change. Based on the invoice, he put in 0.38 liters of eni Rotra 80W-90.
 
'Almost too hot to touch' is only around 60C, which is well within spec for a gear oil. The 90 degree drive converts a percentage of the engine power to heat, the faster you ride, the hotter it will get.

Stephen
 
hhkiwi said:
Thanks, I'll keep that in mind for the next change. The eni Rotra is mineral based.
Click to expand...

Your call. But I don't understand where you're coming from. You post a concern about the CARC getting hot, and then confirm you have dinosaur oil which cannot withstand high temperature without breaking down. But now you're willing to wait until the next oil change before considering a synthetic oil that can withstand extreme temperatures.

It's like comparing about $20 to the price of a new CARC.

Best of luck!
 
eni Rotra is the oil recommended by Guzzi (at least here in Europe) for final drives and is used by my local Guzzi dealer who, by the way, is frequented by Guzzisti from far afield (including Italy!) because of his expertise...

Looking at the specs of the oil (high pressure, high temperature) it can hardly be called dinosaur oil - see: https://oilproducts.eni.com/en_GB/p...gearbox-and-inverter-oils/eni-rotra-mp-80w-90

Also, I wasn't particularly worried about the CARC temperature, having just hauled the bike across the autobahn at up to 6000 rpm - I simply wanted to to hear from others about their experiences.

I would then argue that even for a mineral oil, a temperature of 60 to 70 degrees is not anywhere near the point where it breaks down.

But seeing that oil is obviously a sensitive topic, I will try to avoid that in the future...
 
Manual doesn't say use any oil. Manual says use eni oil..... Trust the Italians, for they are the ones who engineered your motor. Besides, it's so snotty with molly none of your parts are even touching. From what I understand molecularly at least.....
 
Adam Davis said:
Manual doesn't say use any oil. Manual says use eni oil..... Trust the Italians, for they are the ones who engineered your motor. Besides, it's so snotty with molly none of your parts are even touching. From what I understand molecularly at least.....
Click to expand...


Italian companies want you to use Italian oil. Fully synthetic will serve much better than a non synthetic. It is your bike and if you don't want to listen to the experience of others that is up to you. Also I've seen moly react with moisture to form sulfuric acid and etch bearing surfaces. No other manufactures recommends moly in their rear drives. Guzzi doesn't even recommend it in the CARC like they did previously.
 
john zibell said:
Italian companies want you to use Italian oil. Fully synthetic will serve much better than a non synthetic. It is your bike and if you don't want to listen to the experience of others that is up to you. Also I've seen moly react with moisture to form sulfuric acid and etch bearing surfaces. No other manufactures recommends moly in their rear drives. Guzzi doesn't even recommend it in the CARC like they did previously.
Click to expand...
Duly noted. It isn't exactly a sealed system. The breather can in fact allow miniscule water intrusion into the CARC. Thus contaminating the oil. But intrusion will have ill effects on all types of oil, synthetic or otherwise. I wash with care and try to not ride in a downpour when possible. I change it out well before manufacturer rec in manual for that reason. At 3500 miles. Why not it's less than 1/2 a quart and 20 minutes of my time.

Like someone mentioned in thread, oil and tire talk. What's next religion? Lol
 
john zibell said:
Italian companies want you to use Italian oil.
Click to expand...

I am puzzled by that statement. What do you want to imply here? For the record, eni Rotra is also available in a synthetic version (eni Rotra FE 75W-90) so Guzzi could have recommended or specified that one instead.
 
hhkiwi said:
I am puzzled by that statement. What do you want to imply here? For the record, eni Rotra is also available in a synthetic version (eni Rotra FE 75W-90) so Guzzi could have recommended or specified that one instead.
Click to expand...

I was in complete agreement with you, hhkiwi, until this thread prompted me to revisit the eni lubricant advisor. For my CARC Breva 1100, it now advises me to use 0.38 litres of Eni Rotra Bike Synth 75W-90.

http://eni-ita.lubricantadvisor.com/advice.aspx?lang=eng&type=41d1f1f536b20203d69873d047e64eeb
 
MickE said:
I was in complete agreement with you, hhkiwi, until this thread prompted me to revisit the eni lubricant advisor. For my CARC Breva 1100, it now advises me to use 0.38 litres of Eni Rotra Bike Synth 75W-90.

http://eni-ita.lubricantadvisor.com/advice.aspx?lang=eng&type=41d1f1f536b20203d69873d047e64eeb
Click to expand...

What do you expect an oil company to recommend when they have more than one suitable product? The product that makes them the highest profit, of course!

I talked to my Guzzi expert again and he is adamant that the mineral based version is the oil Guzzi recommends. He has been using it for years without problems. Here's a link to the product data sheet by eni with the endorsement by Piaggo (sorry, in German only): https://www.motoroeldirekt.at/data/datenblatt_0006623_1.pdf

I am therefore confident that my CARC will survive with the oil I have until the next change is due, at which point I will consider the synthetic version.
 
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I was having difficulty in tracking the Eni dino oil specified so went and saw a little company we have near by who blend all sorts of oils for a variety of vehicles with the 2 specifications in hand.

After a look the man said "there's nowt special about them"

https://www.withamgroup.co.uk/qualube/
 
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tris said:
I was having difficulty in tracking the Eni dino oil specified so went and saw a little company we have near by who blend all sorts of oils for a variety of vehicles with the 2 specifications in hand.

After a look the man said "there's nowt special about them"

https://www.withamgroup.co.uk/qualube/
Click to expand...

Of course, there isn't anything special about eni oils. Any reputable oil company will have both mineral and synthetic oils suitable for a final drive transmission.

But going back to my original question, I would still be interested in others' experiences with the temperatures of their CARCs after a long, hard ride. Next time you're out for a ride, touch your CARC when you get back and let us know what you find. Is it just warm or actually hot?
 
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