Front brake issue on my '98 EV1100

[bdmitche]

Hello,
I am hoping someone may have experience with this Front Brake issue on my 1998 EV1100.

Bike had been in the garage for last 8-10 months. Battery Tender on it so fully charged.
Every 1-2 months I go out and crank it up and let it run for a few minutes. All good.
About a month ago, weather was nice and I went out to start it up and ride for a while.
All set, I hit the starter button, fired right up. I let it idle for a few minutes, rolled it off the center stand.
Started to back it out of the garage. The driveway drops off a little right out front of the garage.
As I backed out, started to roll down the gentle drop off out of the garage.
Pulled the front brake lever and it went all the way into the grip. No front brake at all.
At that point I had not even a second to hit the rear brake pedal and barely got on it without dropping the bike.
I had both boots on the ground, balancing the bike while rolling backwards.
Having to pull my right foot up to the brake pedal was a harrowing experience.
I feel sure some of you may have experienced something like this.
We NEVER want to drop our motorcycle! With it's weight, you know some damage will be done.

Anyway at that point I have the EV1100 idling in the driveway on level ground.
I went for a short, very careful ride, brought the bike back to the house.

I've never had any issues with the brakes, front or rear, with the three discs brakes work very well.
I checked where I had it parked and there was not brake fluid on the concrete. All cables intact.
I know there is an electrical cable coming out of the right control.
So is it possible this is an electrical issue? Or something related to the fluid or braking mechanism?
I checked my manuals and online and did not find this issue addressed.

At 69 I have been riding for a long time and am very mechanically inclined however I am not a certified Moto Guzzi Repair Technician.
I do have all the tools I could possibly need to do repairs.
I am just at a loss as to where to start.

Any help you could provide would be much appreciated.
Please let me know if you need more details or information.
As you probably know with a motorcycle this old, dealers most likely don't work on them. (closest dealer is in Denver)
Also I really hope this is something I can do myself for financial reasons.

Thank you for taking the time to read this post.
Hope you all have a great week out there.


Bill Mitchell

 

[Kevin.NZ]

I see you went for a short ride, did the the front brake start to operate normally? I think the cable you are referring to could possibly be the rear brake light actuating switch. A possible cause could be with the bike being laid up for a while that the front brake seal in the master cylinder became distorted, if there was moisture in the brake fluid it may have caused corrosion in the bore. . When was the fluid replaced, an overhaul may be in order. I'm sure its not an electrical issue, Don't let the bike idle for a few minutes, its air cooled and could overheat just start it, get on it and go, after you have fixed the brakes that is.

 

[john zibell]

Considering the age of the bike, my recommendation is to replace both the master cylinder and caliper. It also would be a good time to use a steel braided brake line for the front brake. When was the last time brake fluid was changed? Would be a good idea to replace the fluid in the integrated system. You can find the components you need at the Store tab.

 

[V700Steve]

I have a 98EV also. Maybe a fluid change(if you never did your fluid). Could be too low of level & let air in if you haven't done any work on the brakes. I'd suck out what's left & bleed the front then do rear. Lot's of riders don't do anything until an issue arises.
The wire is the brake light switch.

 

[GTM®]

Flush and bleed all of the brakes. Your bike has linked brakes, so the front brake lever only actuates one front caliper. I think Steve is on point with the low fluid and air. I would *thoroughly* inspect and flush the system. Rebuild kits are not available in the U.S., only replacements. Click on the STORE tab above, and use the CONTACT there if you can't find what you need. GTM is a Brembo dealer.

 

[bdmitche]

Flush and bleed all of the brakes. Your bike has linked brakes, so the front brake lever only actuates one front caliper. I think Steve is on point with the low fluid and air. I would *thoroughly* inspect and flush the system. Rebuild kits are not available in the U.S., only replacements. Click on the STORE tab above, and use the CONTACT there if you can't find what you need. GTM is a Brembo dealer.

GTM (Todd?),
Thank you for the guidance.
I will start working on this shortly.

Bill

 

[bdmitche]

I have a 98EV also. Maybe a fluid change(if you never did your fluid). Could be too low of level & let air in if you haven't done any work on the brakes. I'd suck out what's left & bleed the front then do rear. Lot's of riders don't do anything until an issue arises.
The wire is the brake light switch.

Hi Steve,
I have not touched the brake system at all. Have had no issues until now. (I would fall into the category of: Lot's of riders don't do anything until an issue arises.
I'll start with checking fluid levels and proceed from there.
I'll keep you guys posted on my progress.
Thank you and much appreciated,

Bill

 

[bdmitche]

Considering the age of the bike, my recommendation is to replace both the master cylinder and caliper. It also would be a good time to use a steel braided brake line for the front brake. When was the last time brake fluid was changed? Would be a good idea to replace the fluid in the integrated system. You can find the components you need at the Store tab.

Hi John,
I will keep idea of replacing both the master cyl and caliper in mind. (that would be the front caliper)
Like the ss wire braided brake line. Like I mentioned to Steve I have not touched the brake system. I will pull out my manuals and start reading up on this. Keep you posted!
Thanks,

Bill

 

[bdmitche]

I see you went for a short ride, did the the front brake start to operate normally? I think the cable you are referring to could possibly be the rear brake light actuating switch. A possible cause could be with the bike being laid up for a while that the front brake seal in the master cylinder became distorted, if there was moisture in the brake fluid it may have caused corrosion in the bore. . When was the fluid replaced, an overhaul may be in order. I'm sure its not an electrical issue, Don't let the bike idle for a few minutes, its air cooled and could overheat just start it, get on it and go, after you have fixed the brakes that is.

Hello Kevin,
Actually no, front brake did not start operating normally. I'll start with the manuals just to get a better feel for these components. Then Saturday morning I will start inspecting the components. Will be updating you guys as well.
Thank you so much for the information. It helps!

Bill

 

[Vagrant]

Honestly, you could have drained, flushed and bleed the front in less time than it took to write all of this.

 

[bdmitche]

Honestly, you could have drained, flushed and bleed the front in less time than it took to write all of this.

Hi Vagrant,
You are probably right about that! I wish you were here to help me!!
Thanks and have a great day out there!

Bill

 

[Vagrant]

Get a new can of Dot 4. Pull the top cover off and wash the cap, rubber and plastic spacer with brake cleaner. Use a syringe, turkey baster to suck out the old fluid and flush with new fluid. Fill 2/3 full with new fluid, find a clear hose to put on the bleeder, open bleeder a turn and let gravity due it's thing. Keep filling until clean fluid comes out. Close bleeder, put cover on so you don't blow fluid all over, slowly pump up the brake lever until it gets hard. Keep pressure on the lever whi!e you open the bleeder about a half turn. When the handle hits the grip close the bleeder then pump it up again. About three times should get the last of the air bubbles out. If you now have a good brake you got lucky. If not you will need a rebuild or new master cylinder a d possibly caliper too.
Watch a couple of utube videos.

 

[scott_m]

Although my friends here have given you lots of ideas, I would suspect something a little more likely. Your motorcycle is a 1998. This makes everything on it 25-26 years old since manufacturer.

The interior rubber seals of a motorcycle brake master cylinder, are not designed for that long of a service life. Period.

It is almost a given certainty, that the rubber seals have failed and this is why you have no pressure.

Todd is correct that you cannot obtain Brembo rebuild components in the USA thanks to lawsuit happy lawyers, but they are available on the internet and they will ship them to you. AS you say you have some mechanical skills and tools, then the rebuild is pretty straightforward. Take photos with a camera phone all along the way! They are your best friend.

You will need to remove the fluid from the reservoir with a syringe or turret baster. Use some clean rags to sop up the excess fluid remaining at the bottom of the reservoir.

Remove the brake line from the banjo bolt connecting it to the master cylinder assembly. Remove the master cylinder. Remove the lever. Pull out the rubber cover which is over the master cylinder pushrod and then remove the snap ring. The master cylinder pushrod will come out. Keep it in the correct orientation and lay it out on a clean paper towel. You will replace the rubber seals with the replacements, then wipe the master cylinder pushrod assembly clean and carefully reinsert it back into the housing. Replace the snap ring and the rubber cap on the end, then reinstall the lever. Re install the assembly back onto the handlebar and then bleed the brakes as normal. Your problem will be gone.

If you get stuck or lost and you need help, send me a PM and we can arrange to do a FaceTime or Skype or other video call, and I can see what you have and where you are, and give you any additional information you need at that time.

Ok, good luck!

 

[bdmitche]

Get a new can of Dot 4. Pull the top cover off and wash the cap, rubber and plastic spacer with brake cleaner. Use a syringe, turkey baster to suck out the old fluid and flush with new fluid. Fill 2/3 full with new fluid, find a clear hose to put on the bleeder, open bleeder a turn and let gravity due it's thing. Keep filling until clean fluid comes out. Close bleeder, put cover on so you don't blow fluid all over, slowly pump up the brake lever until it gets hard. Keep pressure on the lever whi!e you open the bleeder about a half turn. When the handle hits the grip close the bleeder then pump it up again. About three times should get the last of the air bubbles out. If you now have a good brake you got lucky. If not you will need a rebuild or new master cylinder a d possibly caliper too.
Watch a couple of utube videos.

Vagrant,
I just saw in my email that I had gotten an update on this post.
Wow. That is what I needed to know!
Just never having done this (on this bike) not something I knew all the details on.
Thank you for paring this down to exact process for me.
I really appreciate it.
One last question - is the Dot 4 something I can get at an auto parts store? (like O'Reilly?)
Or do I need to get this from a Moto Guzzi dealer?

Thank you again, and I will be updating you and my other friends on GuzziTech Forums.

Bill Mitchell

 

[scott_m]

Brake fluid is brake fluid. DOT 4 is just the specification you need. Get it at any auto parts store.

 

[bdmitche]

Although my friends here have given you lots of ideas, I would suspect something a little more likely. Your motorcycle is a 1998. This makes everything on it 25-26 years old since manufacturer.

The interior rubber seals of a motorcycle brake master cylinder, are not designed for that long of a service life. Period.

It is almost a given certainty, that the rubber seals have failed and this is why you have no pressure.

Todd is correct that you cannot obtain Brembo rebuild components in the USA thanks to lawsuit happy lawyers, but they are available on the internet and they will ship them to you. AS you say you have some mechanical skills and tools, then the rebuild is pretty straightforward. Take photos with a camera phone all along the way! They are your best friend.

You will need to remove the fluid from the reservoir with a syringe or turret baster. Use some clean rags to sop up the excess fluid remaining at the bottom of the reservoir.

Remove the brae line from the banjo bolt connecting it to the master cylinder assembly. Remove the master cylinder. Remove the lever. Pull out the rubber cover which is over the master cylinder pushrod and then remove the snap ring. The master cylinder pushrod will come out. Keep it in the correct orientation and lay it out on a clean paper towel. You will replace the rubber seals with the replacements, then wipe the master cylinder pushrod assembly clean and carefully reinsert it back into the housing. Replace the snap ring and the rubber cap on the end, then reinstall the lever. Re install the assembly back onto the handlebar and then bleed the brakes as normal. Your problem will be gone.

If you get stuck or lost and you need help, send me a PM and we can arrange to do a FaceTime or Skype or other video call, and I can see what you have and where you are, and give you any additional information you need at that time.

Ok, good luck!

Hi Scott,
Once I get started on this I will see what I have.
You are probably right about state of parts on a 1998 motorcycle.
I bought the bike about 2 years ago from a shop that had it consigned from original owner.
He had included a lot of extra Items, including all manuals, spare parts, filters, oil, very nice Moto Guzzi tank bag and more.
The motorcycle looks immaculate meaning he appeared to have taken very good care of it. New tires, new Corbin seat.
I got a really good deal on it, BUT it is a few years old like you said. The years do take a toll on rubber components.

Your details above are very helpful and if I have difficulties I will definitely get in touch.

Thank you,


Bill Mitchell

*I do have to say that there are some real stand up guys on GuzziTech to take the time to help others with Moto Guzzi issues!
I've owned and ridden many makes of motorcycles over the years and have not seen this level of camaraderie before,
You guys are awesome! Next payday I will be making a donation.

 

[bdmitche]

Hey guys,
I want to apologize to all of you. I didn't mean to disappear after our last posts.
I haven't forgotten about you and your very helpful advice.
A very brief back story. About the time I reached out to you I had just been laid off due to the company's third workforce reduction layoff. Due to financial and market situations. I am 69 years old and my wife had been telling me I ought to retire. I had always told her no, I don't think so. Anyway about a couple of weeks after that Cristi found out the company she had been with for about 5 years was closing due to slowdown of new government contracts. So I had to regroup with her to evaluate our finances going forward, at least for now.
We have a pretty good handle on this situation now which allows me to get back to where I was, what I was doing before all this transpired.
I got the parts Ordered that I needed for this front brake maintenance. Some confusion with the shop as to what exactly I needed to Order. But got that worked out and received the 27661115 Brembo master cylinder lid kit with bellows. Got the other Items needed, clear tubing, turkey baster (I immediately knew that was not going to work) ended up getting a heavy duty syringe from Tractor Supply.
It's a little after 1 am so I am signing off, but I wanted to tell you about my progress (or lack of)
I will update this posting tomorrow.
John thank you for not deleting this post as I am needing a little more help from you guys and I do appreciate it very much.
Also I don't use PayPal. Is there another way I can make a donation to Guzzitech?
Thanks again,

Bill Mitchell

 

[bdmitche]

Thanks Scott,
I do have a question. Last weekend I had a chance to get started on this project.
Got bike on center stand, cleaned the exterior of master cylinder, removed cover from master cylinder and yes, fluid was pretty low.
Fluid was not too dark. Suctioned out what I could.
Then went to front brake on left side (furthest from MC) Cleaned bleeder fitting, placed plastic tube onto fitting, nice and tight.
Loosened bleeder fitting and just a little brake fluid moved up the tube. I bent the tube as low as possible, but no more fluid came out.
At this point I was a little confused. I though that maybe I should insert tip of syringe in tube and pull the plunger out to see if I could increase the flow of fluid. Or make sure there was enough fluid in cylinder, replace cover and pump up the lever. Then when pressure built up, hold lever and loosen bleeder fitting?
Just a little confused about next step.
Also how is flushing the MC and brake lines different from Bleeding the brakes?
Thanks again,

Bill

 

[Kevin.NZ]

Bleeding gets air out of the line and flushing is changing the fluid. Looks like you are flushing the system. After you removed all the fluid from the master cylinder you then have to replenish it with new Dot 4 fluid, put the cap back on the MC then pump up the pressure on the brake lever and hold it in, then release the bleed nipple on the caliper and fluid should shoot out of your plastic tube into a receptacle and the brake lever will hit the handle bar, tighten the bleed nipple, release the brake lever then repeat again until the brake lever moves only a small amount. Dont let the fluid in the MC get low and dont spill any on your bike. Read over Scott and Vagrants replies again, they're spot on.

 

[bdmitche]

Hi Kevin,
Thank you for response and input. This really helps.
Like I mentioned before I have been riding for years, but had not worked on or had any issues with the brakes.
This weekend I will get back up to the storage bldg. and try with input from you, Scott, Vagrants as well as everyone else.
This is a great bike and I am looking forward to getting it out in this spring weather! (with working front brakes I might add!)
Keep you all posted.
Safe travels,

Bill Mitchell