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Tappet noise & strange result of valve adjustment

S

sohcfour

Tuned and Synch'ed
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Milwaukee, WI
All -

I just got my 2009 Griso 8V out on the road for the first time this week (winters in Wisconsin are long). I only rode to work and back, about 8mi round trip, but by the time I got home there was quite a clatter coming from the left cylinder head.

I just removed both valve covers and checked and adjusted the valves. Sure enough, the left intake adjusters had a TON of play. I didn't measure it, but let's say 1mm or more. It was considerable. The lock nuts weren't loose, and it was both left intake valves. (The other 6 valves were OK).

I adjusted all 8 valves, and I was able to adjust the slop out of all of them. However, where 6 of the valves show some adjuster screw visible above lock nut, the 2 left intake valves adjusters are flush with or maybe even below the surface of the lock nut.

I actually measured all 8 valve adjusters vs. the lock nuts. 6 of them show about 0.050in adjuster above the lock nut. The 2 left hand intake valves measured 0.005in below the lock nut.

I started the bike briefly after doing this and it sounds normal again. I did not ride it. Does anyone know what would have caused this? It's as if there's some kind shim in that left hand intake valvetrain that went missing, but I see no evidence of a whole or pieces of any kind of part.

Any input would be highly appreciated.

- Matt
 
Flat tappet failure. Time for the roller upgrade.
Nothin a coupla grand won't fix.
 
Ghezzi... Can you describe more? What part(s) failed? What would have caused it (at 5500mi)? What am I in for in repairs?
 
My guess is that you weren't at TDC on the compression stroke when you set them last time. Ride it, and if they move again, then it's time to investigate further. This question/issue does come up time to time.
 
Isn't it strange though that 2 valves on the same can lobe and tappet would be 1mm different even after readjusting? I mean if not, great! But back to Ghezzis comment... If it were tappet failure would I be able to adjust it out? Would there be some symptoms remaining besides the screw adjuster discrepancy?

For what it's worth, I adjusted the valves last at 4400mi, so I've ridden 1200mi on that adjustment. I change oil with 10/60 synthetic every 1000mi or so.
 
There has been a few cam/tappet failures of the early 8V's. The fact that there is a massive difference in the height of the adjusters but now it is quiet, means metal has been removed from some of the moving components.

When it gets noisy again (in a very short time) and the clearances open up, then my suspicions will be confirmed.
Meanwhile, the shrapnel is circulating round your engine.

For your sake, I hope I'm wrong. email me
 
Contact your local dealer with your VIN # - and see if the recall was ever done.
 
Ghezzi... Understood on the point about the oil. I intend to drain it and check for metal. I also plan to retain a sample. I've Ghent in previous samples from this bike to Blackstone Labs in hopes of having a warning of this type of failure. Up to 1000mi ago there were no such signs of metallic wear.
 
GTRx... I bought the bike a year old with 1000mi on the odo. I brought it right to Jim Barron at Rosefarm for a service and recall confirmation. At that time he confirmed the recall was done.
 
sohcfour said:
I brought it right to Jim Barron at Rosefarm for a service and recall confirmation. At that time he confirmed the recall was done.
Click to expand...
OK, well call him and/or Guzzi Customer Service to confirm. If it's been done, and failing again, you might have some leverage if in fact it's failing.
 
My 2009 with VIN that fell outside the recall went tits up about a month ago. Exactly as you describe. 10,000 miles. I am the fourth owner of this bike. #1 was highly knowledgeable all around good guy. No real info on #2 or #3 (except one of the is a cheap ass bitch and sold the Custom Corbin seat #1 had made). Questionable mantainence but it looked good and sounded good.

Piaggio paid for the parts and extended warrant covered the labor. I consider myself very lucky and will hold on to this bike as I really like it.

If one more thing goes wrong my wife is going to shoot me. And she picked it out!!
 
Katoosh, did you have a third party extended warranty? Curious how you got labor covered and I've heard (not yet confirmed) that my best outcome is the company supplies parts and I pay labor.

General update, the bike is getting trailered to The dealer tomorrow. All evidence points to excessive (and rapid!) tappet wear.
 
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I did. I have usually had lukewarm experience with this type of thing. But this time it paid off in a big way!! I would consider an oil pump as well based on my internet research. I did not. We'll see, won't we.
 
It wasn't me. It was my dealership. Again Piaggio supplied the parts. This is a totally known issue. Shop handled everything. I don't think we typically mentions names but it is in Livermore, CA. Highly recommended.

You can even get yourself a Can-Am roadster (or whatever they call 'em). NOT.
 
katoosh said:
They cleaned it (flushed). That part of the repair. They just didn't cover the oil pump.
Click to expand...
According top Pete Roper, the flush doesn't cut it. It is done to save money. Best to have the oil pump replaced, even it it is on your dime.
 
I had my cams done about 5000 miles ago and have had repeated cam chain tensioner problems since. Clatters on start up sometimes and generally stops within a few revolutions of the engine. Apparently it's the spring-loaded tensioner that's oil-filled and should retain the tension when the engine's stopped. I keep getting an air lock according to the local dealer who's repeatedly bled it! I'm getting the one that he reckons is the problem replaced. But the top ends are sounding marginally clanky at times - but not all the time - I think! I put the horrific sound of failing cams down to my paranoia last time - so am I being paranoid now? Anyone heard of the modified cams failing?
 
That is a tuff nut. The Guzzi 8 valve motor is noisy. It is not even the same noisy all the time, it is normal for the noise to vary. It is hard to tell normal good noise from the bad noise of failing cams.
There are cases of replaced cams failing. Did you get the replacement solid lifters or the latest roller lifters?
There also has been much discussion about WHY the solid lifters failed. There is nothing wrong with solid lifters, they normally work very well (I prefer them to roller lifters). But the consensus seems to be that the oil system over cools the oil and in cooler, damper, climates that results in the oil not burning off water. That leads to the oil becoming mayonnaise and that does not lubricate as well as oil.
Making sure the oil gets over 212 degrees F is key to a happy motor. I think focusing on that is smarter than fitting roller tappets. Roller tappets do not resolve the actual issue, it is merely treating the symptom.
 
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