clutch screach... brake chatter

[vivo]

Hey guys...

My 1100 Griso now has 1300 miles on it and since 600 miles has had two issues that haven't gotten better yet so I thought it's time to ask the other guys who ride this bike..

When braking and close to full stop my front brakes chatter. I assumed they weren't fully bedded in and did mention it to the dealer when I took the bike in for service at 600 miles, didn't know to wait until 900 but that does'nt matter. The point is that the front brakes still chatter and they haven't gotten better yet. This happens while gently braking and almost near to a full stop, they are also a bit grabby at that point.

The second issue is with either the trans or clutch which sometimes makes a screaching when the clutch is being let out. If I release the clutch quickly it's not present but if it's slipped even a bit the sound is there, noticeable enough to start to get on my nerves. Any ideas about this?

While I'm here I might as well ask another question... is the dipstick really hard to read, is the second line up the stick the full line?My bike was serviced only 700 miles ago and after a half hour ride I checked the oil and it reads just slightly above the lower line with the bike upright, off of course and the stick pushed in but not threaded. It seems a bit low but I'm not sure, as I said the stick isn't all that easy to read or it may be just a bit low and it's not reading near the top mark.

Vivo

 

[guzzler]

There have been issues with warpped discs on new bikes, but not for quite a while. I think there may have also been an issue with some of the discs rivets being too tight and not allowing the disc to float.
I too have the clutch noise occaisionally, normally pulling away from standstill. It can also be grabby furhter up the gearbox. I don't know what that is, so we'll have to wait for somenone knowledgeable to help us. I did have a thrust bearing go on my Le Mans II, think that was similar symptoms, but it was about 1980, so I can't really remember!
The dip stick is crap! The second line up is full. You're correct, don't screw the dipstick in to check the level. Someone suggested cleaning it of and using chalk (I think) to mark the edge so it's easy to read. Mine uses about 1/2 a litre of oil every 1500 miles, it sounds like yours may be similar. If you've warmed the engine up to check the oil, remember to leave it for 5-10 minutes to let it drain back. If you done all this and you're near the bottom line you need to top up.
Pete

 

[Penis Rotor]

Do you mean Chatter? or Judder?. My 1100 used to Judder with the original pads just as it was coming to a halt, changing to HH pads helped a lot but it woiuld still tend to do it in hot weather.

As for the clutch noise? No idea for sure but it shouldn't be making any sort of screeching noise. With the lever pulled in there may be a faint ringing at standstill but not a screeching. That sounds like a failed friction plate or a failed bearing of some sort. What year model is this bike and can you give me it's VIN #? There was a problem with a few 1100's where three bearing retainer bolts in the gearbox werem't installed but that was only on a few '06's I thought. I had one and it made a bit of a disconcerting racket.

Pete

 

[vivo]

Hey Pete and the other Pete

My Griso is an 08. I will post the vin as soon as I can see the bikes frame number.

I guess you can say the brakes judder. It doesn't seem rotor related as almost the entire stop feels normal with no pulsing and such. It happens just when the bike is nearin a full stop, a few miles per hour and until dead stop the brakes judder, feels almost like abs but not real abs. It's when the bike is very slow just near a full gentle stop that they behave this way. It has been hot in New Jersey and maybe it's pad material or some type of contamination on the rotors or pads, I'm not sure. I take it that this isn't normal and it isn't because the pads aren't fully bedded in? If so I'll let the dealer deal with it, it's his job to find the cause or replace the pads I guess?

The Screach is when the clutch is being let out gently from a standing stop. It doesn't happen every time and I can make it NOT happen by releasing the clutch quickly and not allowing any slip. Ot almost sounds like a belt or power steering pump on an old car! It makes that kind of noise and then when shifted it stops and doesn't return for upshifts. It's only from full on stop that it sometimes happens and it seems worse when the bike is hotter or after riding a while.

Ahhh and Pete, I may not have allowed enough time for the oil to fully drain back, I may have allowed only two or three minutes before trying to open the cap and check the oil so I'll re check the next ride.

Soooo if I don't know what the screach is it will have to be tended to by my dealer along with the brake thing and might as well have him write up the gauge fogging issue again. If water is causing damage to some gauges then I want it documented I've noticed it from new. I'm not worried or anything, at some point if it's not replaced then I'll try and seal it as it's been posted

hate to take the bike in for service again, the dealer isn't close and it's a bit of a hassle but it would be nice to have it looked to especially if the screach won't resolve itself on it's own...bummer


Vivo

 

[Brian UK]

That brake problem just could be an ABS fault. I remeber a similar issue with an old car I had, which turned out to be a faulty sensor.
Try turning the ABS off, and see if it still happens.

 

[guzzler]

We Grisoists are ABSless Brian.
Pete mine's an 06 bought new in the UK ZGULS00025M111802 do I need a fix, or just buy an 8v.
Pete

 

[cheese]

I had a similar issue with my Norge when new, which turned out to be a loose steering stem. Seems the bottom race was not seated and would slowly creep out of adjustment over time until it was fully seated. Try rocking your bike back and forth with the front brake on. Can you feel a "chucking"? If so, put a finger across the upper steering stem bolt to frame interface while doing the rocking and perhaps you will feel the slop there too.

 

[alanp]

vivo wrote:

The Screach is when the clutch is being let out gently from a standing stop. It doesn't happen every time and I can make it NOT happen by releasing the clutch quickly and not allowing any slip. Ot almost sounds like a belt or power steering pump on an old car! It makes that kind of noise and then when shifted it stops and doesn't return for upshifts. It's only from full on stop that it sometimes happens and it seems worse when the bike is hotter or after riding a while.

Vivo,

For what its worth, my Norge clutch (16,000 miles) has a screach too, and your description is exactly as I would describe mine with one exception. My screach goes away when the bike has been ridden for a while. If I stop it will come back even I parked for only a few minutes and the bike is still really hot. But after a few starts from stopped, it goes away. And it only does it from a dead stop, and the sound is definitely happening as the clutch is in the process of engaging. Seems to work fine though, but it is worrisome.

 

[vivo]

Haha surrree I'll turn the ABS off

I'm thinking you were kidding me but they again?

Vivo

 

[Charlie J]

Gday The cutch on my 06 1100 suddenly felt funny on the way to work one day.I made a stop on the way home and when I took off the clutch made a graunching sound. The rivets on the first friction plate had either broken or pulled through the plate,and this was the only thing that showed a used plate ,no trace of oil or heat.The seals on the clutch pushrod were found to be fitted backwards ex factory.I dont wheelstand the bike or do burnouts and I put the bike in nuetral before stopping. $200 AUS for parts and a bit of time making some tools and my bike with 30 000 has a new clutch.
I am not trying to scare people but shit can and may happen!! The joys of motorcycling.

 

[rguzz]

I have recently experienced a loud clutch screech/ grinding noise, on griso 8v (1400 miles). Is now at dealers under warranty, engine out, parts ordered. Dealer on holiday for 2 weeks, so nothing will happen for 2 weeks.
Apparently the fault lies with clutch pushrod, not the thrust bearing. Will get to know more in 2 weeks.

 

[sbaker]

Hello

Again in the conversation with the Factory tech at Nationals.

Clutch screach can be either:

The thrust bearing is dry and is not turning, It grabs the pushrod and tends to grind it into the clutch plate like a dull drill. Make sure your dealer checks the bearing very closely for wear.

The other cause is just dirt and dust in the plates. It will come and go as the dust and dirt build up/or dissapate.

 

[guzzler]

rguzz wrote

I have recently experienced a loud clutch screech/ grinding noise, on griso 8v (1400 miles). Is now at dealers under warranty, engine out, parts ordered. Dealer on holiday for 2 weeks, so nothing will happen for 2 weeks.
Apparently the fault lies with clutch pushrod, not the thrust bearing. Will get to know more in 2 weeks.

I wish I could say I look forward to finding out what it is!
Mines very intermittent, so I think I'll start worrying when/if it becomes more frequent.
Let's hope it's an easy fix.
Pete

 

[vivo]

Hey there Sam...

Well, in a way it would be good if there is a fix! Took my bike out for a real nice 250 mile day, lots of hills, some pretty roads but area's of frequent stops. The screach is worse stopped on a hill where to take off uphill under load and it's annoying cause it makes me feel like I'm abusing the bike which I know I'm not.

Since the bike has so little mileage and it wasn't ridden in dusty conditions and such I'm of the opinion that it aint dirt but I'll get the bike to my dealer this week for him to go over it. I just hate to part with the thing...

I'll let him know what it may be, then he can do whatever he needs to to get it right. I'll be sure to post the results.

So far my brakes seem like they might be getting better? They aren't worse but I didn't notice the judder much today, only where I first started out, maybe they need to bed in a bit?

vivo

 

[vivo]

If my dealer seems stumped and can't find the fault then I'll be worried... If that were to happen I suppose I would have to help them find fault, if there's something wrong then it's bound to worsen given the break in's done on my bike, it's time to rock and roll...

Time to ride, she's waiting

Vivo

 

[rguzz]

Update on my Griso 8v VIN: ZGULSE0007M111314.West Yorkshire,UK.
1400 miles on clock,clutch screech when hot. Dealer informs it is faulty thrust bearing/pressure plate, and is covered on warranty. Hope to pick machine next week.
Will provide clearer update then.

 

[rguzz]

Got Griso 8v back after warranty repair. "sbaker" was correct, in that the clutch thrust bearing had failed/seized, turning pushrod into clutch, resulting in v.high temp. blueing of end,loosing 2mm of pushrod, and scarred plate on clutch, and damage to hydraulic cylinder surface. The only solution is ENGINE OUT, GEARBOX OFF, and replacement of whole pushrod assembly, and cylinder.
Am going back to workshop to take some pics to post later.
My clutch screeching symtoms came and went over weeks, but would advise anyone with similar to go for the above traumatic cure, nothing else will do.

 

[vivo]

WOW... I still have the screach! I've told the dealer twice about the problem. It doesn't always happen but it does when riding two up and it does at times when hot!

I don't think they took it seriously as I had other issues corrected at the same time.

My bike is now running perfectly after being dyno tuned!!! I would say fantastic even...

My oil is now the correct 10 60 which I did pay to be changed out. The valves are quieter but may have been adjusted again as I think I was charged an hours labor total? Not an issue with me as they adjusted my suspension and it's now spot on!!! Now I'm loving the bike and the last few times I've ridden I have concluded that for me the Griso is easier to ride fast, easier than my SpeedTriple and maybe more precise!

Nothing so far has been done to my clutch but after reading your post I will make sure the dealer is informed and I will also make sure to show then the screach, "get on the back and I'll show you". Once around the block will confirm the noise.

Thanks for posting and I'm glad I mentioned the problem... you made it easier for me to have the bike corrected. Not fond of having the engine out and laying my bike up....sucks!!!!!

How long did it take to have fixed?

vivo

 

[rguzz]

Took a while to order parts,plus bikeshop 2 week summer shutdown.But a full day and half work to sort it.The whole pushrod and end bits had in fact welded together with intense heat caused by friction,as bearing siezed,so had to be very carefully dismantled.One end of pushrod was grinding into slave cylinder,and other end drilling into clutch -- this was the SCREECH.But amazingly still worked before dismantling,and the screech undetectable at low load.So depending on your dealer,warranty work may be challenged as there is no visual or audible clue.
My dealer was sound and believed me,and shocked at what they found on strip down.
Pictures will follow later when I buy camera.
If I'd continued riding old pushrod assembly,eventually there would have been a catastrophic failure,so best have it seen to if anyone has a clutch screech.

 

[vivo]

Rguzz and Sbaker

I'm calling my dealer tommorow to tell them my bike is coming back for the clutch screech work. The screech has gotten worse and now I have no choice but to insist it be torn down and corrected.

I will make them aware of the thrust bearing, push rod situation as reported by you guys. I haven't a doubt that my bike has the same fault...

I'll report back when they have a finding...

If you get any photos can you post them. I suppose it would be helpful in my effort to explain the problem although I shouldn't need to do this.

I'm not allowing the bike back until it's repaired this time, twice before it wasn't taken seriously, not this time.

vivo