How To Recover The 5 Digit Security Code

[scott_m]

It’s even cited in the thread. Look at post #54

“If you have a cut key (one that obviously fits the tumblers), but its transponder is not programmed to the dash, then you can insert the key. The dash will recognize that it is an unregistered transponder (key) and ask you for your User Code. You can then enter the stored user code, and this will override the dash security and allow the unprogrammed key to start the engine. It will also allow you to then program the key to the dash.”

 

[Longshot]

It’s even cited in the thread. Look at post #54

“If you have a cut key (one that obviously fits the tumblers), but its transponder is not programmed to the dash, then you can insert the key. The dash will recognize that it is an unregistered transponder (key) and ask you for your User Code. You can then enter the stored user code, and this will override the dash security and allow the unprogrammed key to start the engine. It will also allow you to then program the key to the dash.”

I had read that and just read it again. You've told others to re-read it also. Again, I admit I'm not all that intelligent. I'm missing something or overcomplicating it I guess, because by reading that I am thinking I am good to go. Maybe I need the code and 2 different programmed keys to be able program a new one.
I will try and figure it out on my own with trial and error. I don't want to frustrate others because I can't understand something lol. I do appreciate you for trying to help.

 

[James Chance]

Appears to me yours was never programmed at the dealer (or by any previous owners) at all. And that you just did the first key yourself. If that's truly the case, and since you KNOW what the code was, you should be able to buy a virgin blank, have a locksmith cut it, and program it as a duplicate key. I'm just glad I found both of my dealer issued keys eventually... ;-)

 

[Longshot]

Appears to me yours was never programmed at the dealer (or by any previous owners) at all. And that you just did the first key yourself. If that's truly the case, and since you KNOW what the code was, you should be able to buy a virgin blank, have a locksmith cut it, and program it as a duplicate key. I'm just glad I found both of my dealer issued keys eventually... ;-)

That's exactly what I'm going to attempt to do. I will post my results. As long as I have a spare key that will start the bike and not display any error codes or ask for a password, etc...I'll be happy. If I'm not successful I will ship the dash off next winter.

Also I will mention...
Since putting in my password earlier today I've noticed I no longer get the key symbol displayed on the dash for several seconds. It instantly displays the dash as would expect for normal operation.

 

[scott_m]

Again, one more time…

Yes.

IF - you have a cut key with a unique transponder code, then provided you know your user code, you can register (program the dash) with up to 4 different keys to the dash.

WHEN - you insert a key into the ignition that fits the tumblers but the transponder chip is not recognized by the dash as being previously registered, the bike will power on because the tumblers turn however the dash will ask you to enter the User Code. Having both of these conditions met, the bike can then be started with the unregistered key.

THEN - you will be able to go to the menu interface, to Add a key. It will ask you to insert Key 1, then your User Code, then insert Key 2.

This is when your unregistered key, gets registered to the dash.

I don’t know any other way to restate this so I hope you understand this now.

The critical understanding point remains that:

The TWO conditions that empower you to be able to do this are EITHER:

#1: Having BOTH a previously REGISTERED (ALREADY BEEN PROGRAMMED INTO THE DASH) cut key AND the User Code. (This will allow you to register up to a total of 4 UNIQUE transponder coded, cut keys via the menu interface - so you can add up to 3 additional keys, for a total of 4 maximum.

OR

#2: Having TWO unique transponder code keys that have previously been REGISTERED (ALREADY BEEN PROGRAMMED) into the dash. When you have this, the dash recognizes each key as being already having been registered to the dash so it will allow you access to the menu so you can RECOVER / RESET the User Code to anything you desire.

CLONED KEYS ARE NOT UNIQUE KEYS. THEY ARE THE EXACT SAME KEY AND THE DASH IS INCAPABLE OF DISTINGUISHING ONE FROM THE OTHER. YOU COULD HAVE A BOX OF 100 CLONED KEYS, AND THE DASH WOULD STILL READ EACH KEY AS BEING THE EXACT SAME KEY.

THIS IS WHY CLONED KEYS WILL NOT HELP YOU TO RECOVER THE USER CODE. YOU MUST HAVE TWO UNIQUE PREVIOUSLY PROGRAMMED KEYS IN ORDER TO RESET THE USER CODE.

In your case, this does not apply BECAUSE you say your discovered your User Code as being the last 5 of your VIN already. You said you confirmed this.

So to do any Menu function for adding a key, all you require is your ONE registered key, and that User Code.

I hope you understand this now…

Another point:

When I say PROGRAM or PROGRAMMED, what this means is that the particular key has been registered (programmed) into the dash as a valid unique key.

You don’t actually “program” the transponder chip. This is not possible with the motorcycle dash firmware.

It is a physical piece of technology that already comes from the key manufacturer, with a unique transponder code embedded on the transponder chip, which is embedded into the key head.

All you can do is register that code, into the dash by using the Add key function.

 

[Moto-Uno]

I know this thread is ongoing , and I enjoy the fact that it's inspired people to actually perform the task and
have it work for them . Someday I may try it myself . Thanks again to "Scott" for his explanation and patience
with many of us . Peter

 

[Longshot]

Just a update to my situation:
I'm still waiting on a blank spare from the guzzi dealer, it will probably be at least a couple more weeks before that arrives, I had placed another order with them and probably waiting for everything to get in and just make one shipment.
However, I had also ordered a inexpensive blank off the internet, $8 shipped, it doesn't come with the transponder antenna thingy. I just had it cut and when I put it in the ignition it asked me for the code, so I put in the code I programmed a few days ago and it starts right up and everything is as it should on the dash. So now I will wait till the key from the dealer comes in and hopefully I will have no problem "registering" it to the bike. I have a feeling after I do that and everything goes ok, that the information in this thread will make a lot more sense to me. Hopefully I haven't jinxed myself (fingers crossed) lol!

 

[Raven]

It sounds like you've got it right. Good luck.

 

[scott_m]

Hopefully I haven't jinxed myself (fingers crossed) lol!

You are going to be just fine my friend. I’m very proud of you and how you have taken this seriously. It made the time I spent trying to communicate this, worth it. Thank you!

So yes, you now know firsthand that with the User Code, you can force the ECU to still start the motorcycle with a cut but unregistered key or even one without a transponder chip!

Those codes are indeed IMPORTANT information. It’s amazing how many people act so nonchalant about it.

Isn’t it fun to learn how things actually truly work instead of somebody’s pure BS?

I always love learning new stuff.

John Zibell and Todd have given me tons of tasty tidbits over the years for which I am eternally grateful.

PS: Have you written this code down in the front page of the owners manual or another logical place? We never assume that we might be gone in an instant, and those who survive us will need that info to preserve maximum value of the motorcycle and also the person who buys it or inherits it!

 

[Longshot]

Thanks Scott and yes I have. I start a log book with every bike I get and record every thing I do to it maint wise. I think maybe what I may be confused on is that earlier in the thread I thought you or someone was saying that in order for the bike to be key functional new from the dealer it has to have had a code entered into it by the dealer or it wouldn't recognize any key, maybe I misread. But it looks like me, along with some others, haven't had that done by the dealer. So perhaps, like in my case (six years later on my 2016 eldo), the key programming password is being entered for the first time. Which is ok by me, lol!

You are going to be just fine my friend. I’m very proud of you and how you have taken this seriously. It made the time I spent trying to communicate this, worth it. Thank you!

So yes, you now know firsthand that with the User Code, you can force the ECU to still start the motorcycle with a cut but unregistered key or even one without a transponder chip!

Those codes are indeed IMPORTANT information. It’s amazing how many people act so nonchalant about it.

Isn’t it fun to learn how things actually truly work instead of somebody’s pure BS?

I always love learning new stuff.

John Zibell and Todd have given me tons of tasty tidbits over the years for which I am eternally grateful.

PS: Have you written this code down in the front page of the owners manual or another logical place? We never assume that we might be gone in an instant, and those who survive us will need that info to preserve maximum value of the motorcycle and also the person who buys it or inherits it

 

[scott_m]

Not exactly.

When the motorcycle is shipped from the factory, there is no User Code entered into the dash.

So, consequently, every time the motorcycle is started, it will ask you to enter a 5 digit code for the first time, but many people do not. Once the code is entered the very first time, it never asks again. Simple.

Unfortunately, some dealers who feel that owners are too dense to understand any of this, they will program whatever code they want to use, thinking that they will be around forever, which never happens in most Moto Guzzi markets. They often forget to inform the customer. When they go out of business, then the code is lost to this obscene carelessness.

Also, all unique keys should be registered to the dash but this also gets blown off.

Unfortunately, this is my huge pet peeve.

Way back when I was Sales Manager at a BMW motorcycle dealership, the most important time spent with a customer was the New Vehicle Delivery process. I required my customers to come to it and would not roll a motorcycle out the door without it. Yet it has become almost non-existent and most customers are way too impatient to listen. This is why critical stuff like this doesn’t get done correctly.

I used to go through everything at least once. Even if the customer didn’t remember how to do it, they did remember that it could be done and they would go back and read the manual.

 

[Nordicnorm]

Unfortunately, this is my huge pet peeve.

Fortunately for us all!

 

[PaulDavies]

Again, one more time…

Yes.

IF - you have a cut key with a unique transponder code, then provided you know your user code, you can register (program the dash) with up to 4 different keys to the dash.

WHEN - you insert a key into the ignition that fits the tumblers but the transponder chip is not recognized by the dash as being previously registered, the bike will power on because the tumblers turn however the dash will ask you to enter the User Code. Having both of these conditions met, the bike can then be started with the unregistered key.

THEN - you will be able to go to the menu interface, to Add a key. It will ask you to insert Key 1, then your User Code, then insert Key 2.

This is when your unregistered key, gets registered to the dash.

I don’t know any other way to restate this so I hope you understand this now.

The critical understanding point remains that:

The TWO conditions that empower you to be able to do this are EITHER:

#1: Having BOTH a previously REGISTERED (ALREADY BEEN PROGRAMMED INTO THE DASH) cut key AND the User Code. (This will allow you to register up to a total of 4 UNIQUE transponder coded, cut keys via the menu interface - so you can add up to 3 additional keys, for a total of 4 maximum.

OR

#2: Having TWO unique transponder code keys that have previously been REGISTERED (ALREADY BEEN PROGRAMMED) into the dash. When you have this, the dash recognizes each key as being already having been registered to the dash so it will allow you access to the menu so you can RECOVER / RESET the User Code to anything you desire.

CLONED KEYS ARE NOT UNIQUE KEYS. THEY ARE THE EXACT SAME KEY AND THE DASH IS INCAPABLE OF DISTINGUISHING ONE FROM THE OTHER. YOU COULD HAVE A BOX OF 100 CLONED KEYS, AND THE DASH WOULD STILL READ EACH KEY AS BEING THE EXACT SAME KEY.

THIS IS WHY CLONED KEYS WILL NOT HELP YOU TO RECOVER THE USER CODE. YOU MUST HAVE TWO UNIQUE PREVIOUSLY PROGRAMMED KEYS IN ORDER TO RESET THE USER CODE.

In your case, this does not apply BECAUSE you say your discovered your User Code as being the last 5 of your VIN already. You said you confirmed this.

So to do any Menu function for adding a key, all you require is your ONE registered key, and that User Code.

I hope you understand this now…

Another point:

When I say PROGRAM or PROGRAMMED, what this means is that the particular key has been registered (programmed) into the dash as a valid unique key.

You don’t actually “program” the transponder chip. This is not possible with the motorcycle dash firmware.

It is a physical piece of technology that already comes from the key manufacturer, with a unique transponder code embedded on the transponder chip, which is embedded into the key head.

All you can do is register that code, into the dash by using the Add key function.

OK - OK - I finally did it - programmed both keys, but I s**t myself twice during the process. The first time happened when I tried to start the bike with a programmed key - nothing happened, dead - zilch - OMG.

Then I realised I was in 1st gear with the side stand down - duh!!.

So I put it into neutral (N on display and green light on dash - gear box a bit stiff at this point due to cold oil, so had to wriggle pedal around a bit to get it there), tried again (breathing heavily now with mild panic and palpitations). Thumbed the starter, bike spluttered a little then died (even more soiled underwear). Looked down and gearbox had jumped from neutral into that inbetween position where a '-' is displayed on the dash. Must have been the vibes during startup.

Anyway gear lever wiggled some more - and bingo both keys start the bike and no more key code messages. Just as well as my underpants wouldn't have taken a third load

Process is very easy when you actually go through it

Cheers Scott

 

[Ed in Ontario]

Again, one more time…

Yes.

IF - you have a cut key with a unique transponder code, then provided you know your user code, you can register (program the dash) with up to 4 different keys to the dash.

WHEN - you insert a key into the ignition that fits the tumblers but the transponder chip is not recognized by the dash as being previously registered, the bike will power on because the tumblers turn however the dash will ask you to enter the User Code. Having both of these conditions met, the bike can then be started with the unregistered key.

THEN - you will be able to go to the menu interface, to Add a key. It will ask you to insert Key 1, then your User Code, then insert Key 2.

This is when your unregistered key, gets registered to the dash.

I don’t know any other way to restate this so I hope you understand this now.

The critical understanding point remains that:

The TWO conditions that empower you to be able to do this are EITHER:

#1: Having BOTH a previously REGISTERED (ALREADY BEEN PROGRAMMED INTO THE DASH) cut key AND the User Code. (This will allow you to register up to a total of 4 UNIQUE transponder coded, cut keys via the menu interface - so you can add up to 3 additional keys, for a total of 4 maximum.

OR

#2: Having TWO unique transponder code keys that have previously been REGISTERED (ALREADY BEEN PROGRAMMED) into the dash. When you have this, the dash recognizes each key as being already having been registered to the dash so it will allow you access to the menu so you can RECOVER / RESET the User Code to anything you desire.

CLONED KEYS ARE NOT UNIQUE KEYS. THEY ARE THE EXACT SAME KEY AND THE DASH IS INCAPABLE OF DISTINGUISHING ONE FROM THE OTHER. YOU COULD HAVE A BOX OF 100 CLONED KEYS, AND THE DASH WOULD STILL READ EACH KEY AS BEING THE EXACT SAME KEY.

THIS IS WHY CLONED KEYS WILL NOT HELP YOU TO RECOVER THE USER CODE. YOU MUST HAVE TWO UNIQUE PREVIOUSLY PROGRAMMED KEYS IN ORDER TO RESET THE USER CODE.

In your case, this does not apply BECAUSE you say your discovered your User Code as being the last 5 of your VIN already. You said you confirmed this.

So to do any Menu function for adding a key, all you require is your ONE registered key, and that User Code.

I hope you understand this now…

Another point:

When I say PROGRAM or PROGRAMMED, what this means is that the particular key has been registered (programmed) into the dash as a valid unique key.

You don’t actually “program” the transponder chip. This is not possible with the motorcycle dash firmware.

It is a physical piece of technology that already comes from the key manufacturer, with a unique transponder code embedded on the transponder chip, which is embedded into the key head.

All you can do is register that code, into the dash by using the Add key function.

Been trying to follow this thread and fix a key code warning, but cant find "add a key" in the menu. I do have "change the code" but that merely changes the user code I need to input.

I had this same problem when I initially purchased my used 2016 Eldorado, but it was corrected at a dealer and good for approximately 3 years. Last weekend while out on a 2 day ride, it just appeared again and I don't want to take it the 2 hours away to the dealership if I don't have to.

The one key can start the bike with no issues other than the icon of the key and red warning triangle remaining on, the secondary key requires an input of my user code to start the bike, and again, the key icon and warning triangle remain on the dash.

Was wondering if the 2016 dashboard might have the "add a key" component somewhere else in the menu?

Any assistance or words of encouragement would be appreciated.

 

[scott_m]

Hi Ed !

Unfortunately, this is not applicable to the 1400's, V7 or V9 platforms. This is only applicable to the Breva/Norge/1200 Sport/Stelvio platforms.

To program keys to a 1400, you are forced to go to a dealer because it requires the PADS diagnostic system (DEALERS ONLY) be connected.

(This is one of the myriad of reasons I am not a fan of these platforms and will never own one regardless of the price. I simply cannot and will not be forced into traveling to a dealer for the most routine and mundane of things such as this.)

I'm sorry I couldn't help you.

 

[Ed in Ontario]

I was afraid of that. I do appreciate you getting back to me.

 

[Longshot]

Finally getting enough time to get back to checking the site and post. Just to follow up, I was able to successfully program my new key from the dealer with no issues. I certainly feel very fortunate I didn't have to send my dash off to be reworked. As Scott mentioned earlier, I think he may be correct that the dealer never programmed a code in the first place.

 

[scott_m]

Excellent! Glad to hear back about it. It's peace of mind for you I am sure. People never think about this until it's too late...

 

[Longshot]

The only part that spooked me is when you have to take the key out and insert the new one to be coded. I wasn't sure what was going to happen when I had to turn the dash off, but fortunately it booted up and picked right back up where it left off

 

[Gezza]

OK at the risk of incurring some wrath from those that have repeatedly explained this, my stupid question is also around the procedure for retrieving and / or reseting the code. I read, understood and accept completely the reasons given as to why; but its the how that has me confused.
The manual and the threads above both say "insert key 1 blah blah blah then insert key 2" but I already had the key inserted to access the menu - so do I turn it off and remove Key 1 then turn it all back on again using Key 1; - won't that just take me back to the same point again and again - or do I instead insert Key 2 and then do it all again with Key 2 but this time remove it and insert Key 1 to program it ?. In short I'm somewhat confused by the Insert Key 1 instruction when it is already inserted.